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 Post subject: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 8:35 am 
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I've heard Buffy is way more consistent, so I'm gonna check and see if I actually agree with it myself. Since Buffy Seasons 1 and 7 suck, I'll be comparing Ats Season 1 to Buffy Season 6.

Season 1 vs Season 6

1. City Of>Bargaining Part 1

2. Bargaining Pt 2>Lonely Hearts

3. After Life>In the Dark

4. Flooded>I fall to Pieces

5. Room w/a Vu>Life Serial

6. Sense and Sensitivity>All the Way

7. Once More With Feeling>>>>>>>>>The Bachelor Party

8. I Will Remember You>Tabula Rasa

9. Hero>Smashed

10. Parting Gifts>Wrecked

11. Somnambulist>>>Gone

12. Expecting>Doublemeat Palace

13. Dead Things>>>>>>>>>>>>She

14. I've Got You Under My Skin>>Older and Far Away

15. The Prodigal>As You Were

16. Hell's Bells>The Ring

17. Normal Again>Eternity

18. Five by Five>Entropy

19. Sanctuary>Seeing Red

20. Villains>War Zone

21. Blind Date>Two to Go

22. To Shanshu in L.A.>Grave

Score:
Angel-14
Buffy-8

Season 2 vs Season 2

1. When She Was Bad>Judgement

2. Are You Now or Have You Ever Been>Some Assembly Required

3. School Hard>First Impressions

4. Untouched>Inca Mummy Girl

5. Dear Boy>Reptile Boy

6. Halloween>Guise Will Be Guise

7. Darla>Lie To Me

8. The Dark Age>The Shroud of Rahmon

9. The Trial>What's My Line Pt. 1

10. Reunion>What's my Line pt. 2

11. Redefinition>Ted

12. Blood Money>Bad Eggs

13. Surprise>Happy Anniversary

14. Innocence>The Thin Dead Line

15. Reprise>Phases

16. Epiphany>Bewitched, Bothered, and Bewildered

17. Passion>Disharmony

18. Dead End>Killed by Death

19. I Only Have Eyes for You>Belonging

20. Over the Rainbow>Go Fish

21. Becoming pt 1>Through the Looking Glass

22. Becoming pt 2>There's No Place Like Plrtz Glrb

Score:
Angel-12
Buffy-10

Season 3 vs Season 3

1. Anne>Heartthrob

2. That Vision Thing>Dead Man's Party

3. Faith, Hope and Trick>That Old Gang of Mine

4. Beauty and the Beasts>Carpe Noctem

5. Homecoming>Fredless

6. Band Candy>Billy

7. Revelations>Offspring

8. Lover's Walk>Quickening

9. Lullaby>The Wish

10. Amends>Dad

11. Gingerbread>Birthday

12. Helpless>Provider

13. Waiting in the Wings>The Zeppo

14. Bad Girls>Couplet

15. Loyalty>Consequences

16. Sleep Tight>Doppelgangland

17. Forgiving>Enemies

18. Earshot>Double or Nothing

19. Choices>The Price

20. The Prom>A New World

21. Benediction>Graduation Day pt 1

22. Graduation Day pt 2>>>>>>>Tomorrow

Score:
Angel-7
Buffy-15

Season 4 vs Season 4

1. Deep Down>The Freshman

2. Living Conditions>Ground State

3. The Harsh Light of Day>>>>>>>>>>>>>The House Always Wins

4. Fear Itself>Slouching Towards Bethlehem

5. Supersymmetry>Beer Bad

6. Spin the Bottle>Wild at Heart

7. The Initiative>Apocalypse Nowish

8. Pangs>Habeas Corpses

9. Something Blue>Long Day's Journey

10. Hush>Awakening

11. Soulless>Doomed

12. Calvary>A New Man

13. Salvage>The I in Team

14. Release>Goodbye Iowa

15. Orpheus>This Year's Girl

16. Who Are You?>Players

17. Superstar>Inside Out

18. Shiny Happy People>Where the Wild Things Are (Ugh, rubbish selection)

19. New Moon Rising>The Magic Bullet

20. The Yoko Factor>Sacrifice

21. Primeval>Peace Out

22. Restless>Home

Score:
Angel-9
Buffy-13

Season 5 vs Season 5

1. Conviction>Buffy vs Dracula
2. Real Me>Just Rewards
3. The Replacement>Unleashed
4. Hell Bound>Out of My Mind
5. No Place Like Home>Life of the Party
6. Family>The Cautionary Tale of Numero Cinco
7. Fool For Love>Lineage (Barely)
8. Destiny>>Shadow
9. Harm's Way>Listening to Fear
10. Soul Purpose>Into the Woods
11. Damage>Triangle
12. You're Welcome>Checkpoint
13. Blood Ties>Why We Fight
14. Smile Time>Crush
15. A Hole in the World>I Was Made to Love You
16. I'm gonna get KILLED for this, but... Shells>The Body
17. Underneath>Forever
18. Origin>Intervention
19. Time Bomb>Tough Love
20. Spiral>The Girl in Question.
21. Power Play>The Weight of the World
22. Not Fade Away>The Gift

Score:
Angel-15
Buffy-7

Overall Score:
Angel 57
Buffy 53

I like Angel more. There, I said it. 8)

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Last edited by Flamepillar112 on Sun Sep 11, 2016 6:36 am, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 10:58 am 
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What the hell, I've got a bit of time to kill and it'll be funny seeing how dramatically different my opinions are. (I might even get a chance to be positive about Buffy!)

Ate S1 vs BtVS S6

Buffy wins on everything except Parting Gifts, Somnambulist, I've Got You Under My Skin, The Prodigal. and Blind Date. Not even close.

AtS S2 vs BtVS S6

Buffy wins on everything except Are You Now or Have You Ever Been, Untouched, Dear Boy, Darla, Reunion, Redefinition, Blood Money, Over the Rainbow and Reprise - more even.

AtS S3 vs BtVS S3

Buffy wins on everything except Sleep Tight, Forgiving and Benediction. Angel is absolutely demolished here.

AtS S4 vs BtVS S4

Buffy wins on everything except Deep Down, Supersymmetry, Calvary, Salvage, Release, Shiny Happpy People. Somehow Angel performs better here than last time even though this is its least consistent season.

AtS S5 vs BtVS S5

Buffy wins on everything except Hell Bound, Destiny, Harm's Way, Damage, You're Welcome, Smile Time, A Hole in the World, Underneath, Origin, Time Bomb, Power Play and Not Fade Away. Angel actually pulls a slight majority here and it's just unlucky the first half is so awfully weak.

So, yeah.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 12:23 pm 
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Flamepillar112 wrote:
16. I'm gonna get KILLED for this, but... Shells>The Body



Yeah...You're dead to me.

Shells is pretty fantastic though. :D

If I were to do this it would definitely be majority Buffy just looking at the comparisons. B5vA5 would be tough for me though.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 1:43 pm 
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"Grave" better than "To Shanshu in LA? "Doomed" better than "Soulless"? "Entropy" and "Seeing Red" better than Five by Five" and "Sanctuary"? About Angel Season 3, I really, really like the first few standalones, while Btvs s3 had kind of a rocky start, so it got a few wins from there. "Lullaby" is for me better than "The Wish", because it has more depth and consequences, while "The Wish" is detached, purely for the benefit of the viewer. "Gingerbread" feels like a s1 episode, so while "Birthday" isn't the strongest episode out there, it's certainly better than "Gingerbread". "Waiting in the Wings" is a Joss Whedon masterpiece, while The Zeppo is a very clever and funny episode. It was a close call, but The Zeppo doesn't quite hit the highs of "Waiting in the Wings". Loyalty is an intriguing Wesley episode, so that's always great. Consequences is very good, but that's about it. It's really, really, solid, but every time I watch it I ask myself "What's missing?". So yeah, Ats S3 is far inferior to Buffy S3, it just happened to luck out that Buffy's weaker episodes happened to be where Angel's strong ones were.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 1:44 pm 
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"The Body" is the superior exploration of grief. It also has better cinematography.

But "Shells" is better in telling a story about the aftermath of a death, as opposed to just depicting it. And, frankly, I enjoy it ever so much more.

I would be hard put to say which is "better." Both succeed amazingly well at what they set out to do. But I have no difficulties whatsoever to picking out a favourite between the two.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 1:51 pm 
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unkinhead wrote:
Flamepillar112 wrote:
16. I'm gonna get KILLED for this, but... Shells>The Body



Yeah...You're dead to me.

Shells is pretty fantastic though. :D

If I were to do this it would definitely be majority Buffy just looking at the comparisons. B5vA5 would be tough for me though.


The reason I went with Shells is because it feels like the epitome of an Angel episode done right. The Body, while a stunning masterpiece, feels like an entirely different show. This isn't a criticism of course, but I think it diminishes the episode slightly. Shells though, gets better the more I watch it. I didn't really appreciate it on first viewing, but after reading Iguana's review, it completely blew me away on second viewing. So, props.

Also, with the exceptions of Buffy Seasons 3 and 5, I feel it's pretty hit or miss. Episodes like "Doublemeat Palace" next to "Dead Things", or "Hush" next to "Doomed". Then of course you have Season 7, which is thoroughly mediocre with the exception of a couple episodes. Angel at its weakest though, is mostly average, with the exception of a few terrible episodes. The show doesn't fire on all cylinders more often than I would like, though. The episodes that are average have great material in them too, ....mixed in with terrible material. I actually found it very interesting that when I read the ACP reviews, I noticed the reviews in the yellow were usually 1/2 bashing and 1/2 gushing. Anyway, the amount of average episodes does in a way make it inferior to Buffy, Breaking Bad, and other shows of the like. Yet, I still love it just as much. When it does deliver, damn. Plus, the Darla arc from S2 and the back half of S5 are basically my favorite tv runs ever. Plus, even the weaker seasons do have genuinely great material as well that people tend to overlook due to the "Provider"s and the "House Always Wins"s.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 2:41 pm 
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Also, Freudian Vampire, while "Expecting" is not a good episode, "Doublemeat Palace" is awful. I wouldn't watch it if you bloody paid me to.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 3:16 pm 
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Flamepillar112 wrote:
Also, Freudian Vampire, while "Expecting" is not a good episode, "Doublemeat Palace" is awful. I wouldn't watch it if you bloody paid me to.

Lies and slander! "Doublemeat Palace" is one of the highlights of the sixth season, and it always makes my top 25. Flawed? Yes. But it's one of the most unique episodes of the entire show.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 3:25 pm 
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But.. but.. It's about some chemical and burgers or something? And Willow is once again botched.

In all seriousness though I sympathize with your plight. I don't get the hate for "superstar"

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 9:27 pm 
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S6B Vs S1A- Only episodes of Angel i'd take over S6 would be Parting Gifts, Somnambulist, I've got you under my skin, The Prodigal, the Faith 2 parter and Shanshu in LA. S6 has far more excellent episodes and the fact it has an arc makes even the weaker episodes more interesting, than the constant MOTW in S1A. And i also like Doublemeat Palace.

S2B Vs S2A- Episodes of Angel i prefer- Are you now or Have you Ever Been, Untouched, Dear Boy, Darla, Shroud of Rahman, The Trial, Reunion, Redefinition, Blood Money, Reprise, Epiphany, Over the Rainbow. Both very good seasons, the end of S2A really does let down the season, while S2B is one of the best stretches of episodes. And has a superior arc, so S2B slightly over S2A

S3B Vs S3A- Episodes of Angel i prefer- That vision thing, That Old Gang of Mine, and Benediction because i feel sorry for S3A. That sums it up really, the best of S3A, simply have better from S3B. The one thing i do prefer over S3A to S3B, is that it doesn't take the easy way out. But S3B far superior.

S4B Vs S4A- Episodes of Angel i prefer- Deep Down, Supersymmetry, Soulless, Salvage, Inside Out, Shiny happy People and Peace Out. S4A was a mess, but an enjoyable mess, but S4B just far superior, it made Adam look like a good Big Bad.

S5B Vs S5A- Episodes of Angel i prefer- Destiny, Damage, You're Welcome, Hole in the World, Underneath, Origin, Time Bomb, Not Fade Away. This season is let down by a poor first half, but it does have an incredible final stretch of episodes, but S5B was still to consistent and had just as many heights, and didn't have as many MOTW episodes. So S5B wins aswell.

Buffy 5-0


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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 9:55 pm 
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Though I've seen them at least a few times each, I can't recall individual episodes of ANGEL well enough to do comparisons. Part of that is due to ANGEL seasons virtually always letting me down in the last handful of episodes (making me not want to bother revisiting them years later), which is why I only own Season 5 (which, thankfully, didn't) on DVD.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 11:00 pm 
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I'm in the middle of watching both shows simultaneously I should wait, but I have free time right now, so why not.

S6 v S1
1. Bargaining P1 < City Of
2. Bargaining P2 < Lonely Hearts
3. After Life > In the Dark
4. Flooded > I Fall to Pieces
5. Life Serial < Rm W/ a Vu
6. All the Way < Sense & Sensitivity
7. Once More With Feeling > The Bachelor Party
8. Tabula Rasa < I Will Remember You
9. Smashed < Hero
10. Wrecked < Parting Gifts
11. Gone < Somnambulist
12. Doublemeat Palace < Expecting
13. Dead Things > She
14. Older and Far Away > I've Got You Under My Skin
15. As You Were < The Prodigal
16. Hells Bells > The Ring
17. Normal Again > Eternity
18. Entropy < Five by Five
19. Seeing Red < Sanctuary
20. Villains > War Zone
21. Two to Go > Blind Date
22. Grave < To Shanshu in LA

Angel: 13
Buffy: 9
This is interesting, because I prefer Buffy s6 to Angel s1, but most of the eps were hard to decide between and both are great. Angel's lack of story arc really brings it down.

S2 v S2
1. When She Was Bad > Judgment
2. Some Assembly Required < Are You Now or Have You Ever Been
3. School Hard > First Impressions
4. Inca Mumm Girl < Untouched
5. Reptile Boy < Dear Boy
6. Halloween > Guise Will be Guise
7. Lie to Me < Darla
8. The Dark Age > The Shroud of Rahmon
9. What's My Line P1 < The Trial
10. What's My Line P2 < Reunion
11. Ted < Redefinition
12. Bad Eggs < Blood Money
13. Surprise > Happy Anniversary
14. Innocence > The Thin Dead Line
15. Phases < Reprise
16. Bewitched, Bothered, and Bewildered < Epiphany
17. Passion > Disharmony
18. Killed by Death < Dead End
19. I Only Have Eyes For You > Belonging
20. Go Fish < Over the Rainbow
21. Becoming P1 > Through the Looking Glass
22. Becoming P2 > There's No Place Like Plrtz Glrb

Angel: 12
Buffy: 10
Also unexpected, I go back and forth with these two. I usually give Angel s2 the edge because of it's consistency, but Buffy s2's closing arc is fantastic, and closing arcs usually leave the stronger impression.

S3 v S3
1. Anne > Heartthrob
2. Dead Mans Party < That Vision Thing
3. Faith, Hope, and Trick > That Old Gang of Mine
4. Beauty and the Beasts > Carpe Noctem
5. Homecoming > Fredless
6. Band Candy < Billy
7. Revelations > Offspring
8. Lover's Walk > Quickening
9. The Wish > Lullaby
10. Amends < Dad
11. Gingerbread < Birthday
12. Helpless > Provider
13. The Zeppo < Waiting in the Wings
14. Bad Girls > Couplet
15. Consequences > Loyalty
16. Doppelgangland > Sleep Tight
17. Enemies > Forgiving
18. Earshot > Double or Nothing
19. Choices > The Price
20. The Prom > A New World
21. Graduation Day P1 > Benediction
22. Graduation Day P2 > Tomorrow

Buffy: 17
Angel: 5
Well, duh. I do support Angel s3 and think it's a bit underrated, but Buffy s3 is unmatched

S4 v S4
1. The Freshman < Deep Down
2. Living Conditions > Ground State
3. The Harsh Light of Day > The House Always Wins
4. Fear Itself < Slouching Towards Bethlehem
5. Beer, Bad < Supersymmetry
6. Wild at Heart > Spin the Bottle
7. The Initiative > Apocolypse, Nowish
8. Pangs > Habeas Corpses
9. Something Blue > Long Day's Journey
10. Hush > Awakening
11. Doomed < Soulless
12. A New Man < Calvalry
13. The I in Team < Salvage
14. Goodbye Iowa < Release
15. This Year's Girl < Orpheus
16. Who Are You? > Players
17. Superstar < Inside Out
18. Where the Wild Things Are < Shiny Happy People
19. New Moon Rising > The Magic Bullet
20. The Yoko Factor > Sacrifice
21. Primeval > Peace Out
22. Restless > Home

Buffy: 12
Angel: 10
I'd expect a bigger discrepancy there considering I don't like much of season four, but the stronger Faith arc and good beginning bumped it up a bit. Overall I like s4 of Buffy and don't like s4 of Angel, though.

S5 v S5
1. Buffy vs. Dracula > Conviction
2. Real Me > Just Rewards
3. The Replacement > Unleashed
4. Out of My Mind > Hell Bound
5. No Place Like Home > Life of the Party
6. Family > The Cautionary Tale of Numero Cinco
7. Fool for Love > Lineage
8. Shadow > Destiny
9. Listening to Fear < Harm's Way
10. Into the Woods > Soul Purpose
11. Triangle > Damaged
12. Checkpoint < You're Welcome
13. Blood Ties > Why We Fight
14. Crush < Smile Time
15. I Was Made to Love You < A Hole in the World
16. The Body > Shells
17. Forever > Underneath
18. Intervention > Origin
19. Tough Love > Time Bomb
20. Spiral > The Girl in Question
21. The Weight of the World > Power Play
22. The Gift > Not Fade Away

Buffy: 18
Angel: 4
Well, of course. I abhor Angel s5. Even the successful closing arc pales in comparison to Buffy's. Choosing between the finales took a few seconds to think about, though. Both are excellent.

So this would indicate a Buffy preference. Buuuut I already knew that, so...


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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 6:48 am 
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I had trouble choosing because I'm a die hard fan of both. Ats seasons 3 and 4 aren't great comparatively, but they are still strong seasons, Ats s3 is about on par with btvs s4, because both do some things incredibly right. S3 did emotion very well, while s4 of btvs did humor very well. However, both fail with the main arc pretty hard. Ats s4 is a mess, but it's an interesting and enjoyable mess, and I'd take that over Buffy Season 7 any day. Ats s1 is.......interesting. It's below BTVS 2,3, and 5, but definitely abve 1,4, and 7. Seasons 2 and 5 are amazing, and equal to if not better than Buffy. Even Buffy's best seasons have some significant problems. Also, I really disagree that Buffy Season 5 reaaches the heights of Ats s5. When I think of standouts from Buffy s5, I think "Fool For Love", "The Body", and "The Gift"....uh....."Crush"? Anyway Angel has Lineage, Destiny, You're Welcome, Smile Time, Shells, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 7:56 am 
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Also, Shadow>Destiny? Really?

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 Post subject: Re: Angel vs Buffy: Season by Season
PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 8:09 am 
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Eh, Destiny has a really contrived plot and I was so disinterested in the episode that it managed to make no lasting impact. Maybe when I rewatch I'll think differently, but Shadow at least is a component of something I like rather than a component of something I find tedious. I can understand why people would feel the opposite, but personally that's where my preference swings.


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