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| Writer: | David Fury |
| Director: | Daniel Attias |
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| - | Review |
Fun, fun, fun! This episode is just plain fun! Luckily it's also extremely relevant as well, which is why it scores so big. I suppose if for some crazy reason you don't like Spike, this episode isn't very appealing, but for the rest of us it's quite a treat. Buffy finds out Spike's in love with her and "wackiness ensues." This storyline has obviously been in heavy development since Spike's passioned dream/nightmare in "Out of My Mind" (5x04), and finally Buffy does something about it. Although a bit convenient, it's a perfect test for Spike to have Drusilla return and lure him back to how things used to be. It all begins...
...with dancing at the Bronze. Only this time it's worth noting that Buffy herself doesn't dance and prefers to hang back and watch others having fun. Her life is really taking its toll on her and it's starting to show. Spike uses this opportunity to try to initiate casual conversation with Buffy. Enter the always amusing flowering onion. Before S5 Buffy would be dancing on the floor with her friends. Now she's not, and in S6 she's giving into Spike's maneuvers (and thensome), exploring the shadows. Buffy's right at the crossroads between the two here, which is probably why she jumps at the opportunity to hang out with Ben, which shows that she's still barely clinging onto the idea of having that normal life and that normal boyfriend, which after Riley she should know better. She comes to an important realization about this in the next episode, "I Was Made to Love You" (5x15).
Dawn gets some useful attention following her discovery in "Blood Ties" (5x13), but it's by hanging out with Spike who actually giving her some no-frills advice. He says, "Doesn't seem to me it matters very much how you start out." This scene is also high in entertainment due to Buffy crashing Spike's storytelling. This leads to Dawn telling Buffy that Spike's in love with her. Buffy's response is one of her best in the entire series: this non-chalant, very confused and surprised "huh?" I also love how she says "hanging out with Spike isn't 'cool' Dawn, okay?" hahaha!
Most of this episode explores Spike's side of things, as Buffy's response is fairly straightforward: surprised and somewhat disturbed. When Buffy and Xander are checking out the crime scene in the train, it quickly becomes obvious that what Dawn said about Spike has been bugging Buffy since she heard it. Xander laughs at the knowledge and Buffy says, "I'm not joking." Xander responds with a golden response: "Oh, I hope not. It's funnier if it's true!" Funnier indeed, because it leads to Spike's hilarious fabricated date with Buffy. The bourbon, the "hey!," the "eww," and the singing all in Spike's car... wow, yes (where did Spike's car go after this though?).
Inside the vamp nest there's more great, fun dialogue. Buffy says, "What is this?" Spike replies, "Oh, come- don't get your knickers twisted, I was-" Buffy interrupts, "What ... is this? The late-night stakeout, the bogus suspects, the flask? Is this a date?" Spike quickly responds, "A d- Please! A date? You are completely off your bird! I mean - Do you want it to be?" Buffy looks like she's about to heave right about now.
Joyce later asks if Buffy led Spike on at all. She responds, "Well, I... I do beat him up a lot. For Spike that's like third base." Buffy definitely understands Spike fairly well, which in retrospect is just faintly hinting at the events to come, particularly in "Smashed" (6x09). Now that Spike's little secret is out it's, of course, the perfect time for Drusilla to reappear to test the extext of his 'love,' which is still somewhat more like an obsession at this point. Spike tries to go back to how things were when he was with Dru, but very quickly realizes that he has changed.
The Dru/Spike scene at the Bronze can be added as another brilliant classic moment for this wonderfully fascinating couple. Perfect acting, perfect music, and perfect direction allow Spike to revel in the final time he gets to relive the old days, even though he still momentarily questions it. It also occurs to me that this is the first time in a long while we've seen Spike's vamp face on (I believe "Fool for Love" (5x07) was the last time). Ever since his dream/nightmare in "Out of My Mind" (5x04) he's definitely been different.
All of these scenes culminate to the moment when Buffy discovers the hidden 'Buffy Altar' in the bottom of Spike's crypt, which is extremely creepy. Spike then chains up the girl he supposedly loves and demands something in return from her. This is, indeed, very sick, although not unexpected from Spike. At this point he just has no clue what real love is. He's trying to interpret his feelings in the only way he knows how. Eventually by the end of S6 he figures out that the only way he will be enabled to understand what love is really about (which goes beyond just feelings) is by getting a soul.
For now, though, he can only prove his raw feelings are genuine. Offering to kill Drusilla for Buffy does prove at least that much. All this is simply too much for Buffy right now so she shuts him out. The look on his face when he learns that Buffy's used the reverse invitation spell on him is painful to watch, even after all the disturbing stuff he's done. He looks so hurt and surprised. To make me feel sorry for a guy that twisted is an extremely impressive feat. The writers on this show are simply amazing.
I really love this episode. It's not a powerhouse episode worthy of a P, but it sure delivers the goods. This season's really hit a stride and is providing some fantastic character development and is still high on entertainment. While the season will retain its quality for the rest of the season, its tone is getting really close to dramatically changing forever. While I admit to confusion about why Glory wouldn't be tearing Buffy's door down in anger after their encounter in "Blood Ties" (5x13), this episode is really perfectly placed in the season.
| - | Minor Pros/Cons (+/-) |
| Pros: | |
| + | Joyce tells Buffy she feels a lot more safe with her in the house while Giles is right there listening. She amusingly backpedals and tries to make Giles feel better. |
| + | Buffy notices that her sweater, taken by Spike in "Shadow" (5x08), is gone and yells at Dawn for it. |
| + | Harmony is back with Spike again and now she's even willing to play sex games, play-acting as Buffy in Buffy's sweater. She must be very desperate. |
| + | Spike hanging out with Joyce and Dawn, all laughing together as Buffy walks in the room looking very concerned. |
| + | It's cool that Dru has burns on her gotten from "Redefinition" (AtS 2x11). Her plan seems to be to get Spike to go back to L.A. with her and possibly join-up with Darla again. I wonder where Dru went after this episode. |
| + | Harmony gets all mad at Drusilla, but Spike just casually ditches her. This is the last we see of her until she appears on Angel S5 (and, of course, "Disharmony" [AtS 2x17]). |
| + | The 'fight' between Buffy, Harmony, Drusilla, and Spike is very fun. |
| Cons: | |
| - | Why did Buffy just let Drusilla leave? That's an incredibly deadly vampire she just let walk away. |
| - | Foreshadowing |
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| - | Quotes |
| ANYA: | Xander, I think you may have hurt his feelings. |
| XANDER: | And you should never hurt the feelings of a brutal killer. (ponders) You know, that's, uh, that's actually some pretty good advice. |
| XANDER: | The point is, I work hard for that money. |
| SPIKE: | And you're saying I didn't? |
| XANDER: | You stole it. |
| SPIKE: | And you're making it into very hard work! |
| SPIKE: | They're just trying to keep you safe, I expect. |
| DAWN: | I feel safe with you. |
| SPIKE: | Take that back! |
| BUFFY: | What, that chip in your head? That's not change. Tha-that's just ... holding you back. You're like a serial killer in prison! |
| SPIKE: | Women marry 'em all the time! |
| BUFFY: | Uhh! |
| HARMONY: | You'd better not be thinking what I think you're thinking. 'Cause my answer is the same as always. No threesomes unless it's boy, boy, girl. Or Charlize Theron. |
| SPIKE: | Oh, what... Ohh! (shouting) Gaaah! What the bleeding hell is wrong with you bloody women!?!? What the hell does it take!? Why ... do you bitches torture me? |
| BUFFY: | Which question do you want me to answer first? |
| - | Score | Learn about the Grading Scale |
| 95/100 |
A ■ ■ ■ ■ ■ |
A sharply written episode consisting of zero major mistakes. Usually develops characters in a meaningful manner and is a joy to watch on repeat viewings. Near perfect, but not quite there.
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| - | Screencaps |
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Comments (43)
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| 1. | AriDec 30, 2006 (Sat)Link | |
| I don't think there's any one right way to love someone. Yes, Spike getting the soul makes him more mature in his love, but I think love that's twisted and somewhat selfish in nature can be just as real (and definitely more interesting to watch *g*). No one's perfect after all, granted some more so than others. Then I again I'm convinced Buffy fell in love with Spike in S6 (thanks to Dead Things) so what the hell do I know? Hehe. |
| 2. | mikejerDec 30, 2006 (Sat)Link | |
| There may not be any one right way, but there are wrong ways. Chaining up the girl and threatening to kill her if she doesn't reciprocate feelings is an example of a wrong way. To be honest, I'd raise an eyebrow if you thought otherwise. ;) |
| 3. | Clem's Kitten BasketDec 31, 2006 (Sun)Link | |
| "Chaining up the girl and threatening to kill her if she doesn't reciprocate feelings..." I'm not quite sure of what you're referring to with this? The chaining up part has nothing to do with Spike's love for Buffy. It's a very practical way of getting her to listen to him. This way Buffy can't run away and she can't hit him, which is what she usually does. When Spike says that he'll prove his love for Buffy by dusting Drusilla, his reasons and explanations are quite good actually and Buffy should realize that, because Angel dusted Darla. The bond between a vampire and his sire, especially when it's combined with love (even the "worst" vampiric kind) and a more than century old partnership, is an exceptionally strong one. The concept of "real love" is very tricky, isn't it? It's even more complicated here than in real life, since Spike and Buffy both are a couple of highly unusaul and very complex individuals. |
| 4. | bookwormDec 31, 2006 (Sun)Link | |
| I'm with mikejer on this, it doesn't prove anything, than "that he's a sick vampire, she should have dusted years ago". chaining someone up against his/ her will is definitely wrong, even if it is to just make me listen. no matter what the person is trying to say. (and besides, as I remember, Spike said, that he would untie Dru, if Buffy wouldn't confess that they had some kind of bond...) |
| 5. | Clem's Kitten BasketDec 31, 2006 (Sun)Link | |
| The point here is, that it (dusting Drusilla) means something to Spike. If it means something to you or me is irrelevant. The perspective is everything. I'm not using a real life metaphor now, but it seems that you (bookworm) and mikejer are. My perspective is purely within the show. |
| 6. | mikejerDec 31, 2006 (Sun)Link | |
| Spike offering to kill Drusilla for Buffy does mean something, I never claimed otherwise. I'm just pointing out that tieing a girl up and threatening to unleash another vampire on her if she doesn't reciprocate feelings is pretty twisted, no matter which way you look at it. Coming from Spike, who we understand pretty well at this point, it's not all that surprising, but that doesn't make it any less wrong. It just goes to show that Spike still has a long ways to go at this point. |
| 7. | bookwormDec 31, 2006 (Sun)Link | |
| if I wouldn't be allowed to use "real-world-metaphors" in while arguing on a fictional, fantastical story, my horizon would be a little limited. as you may have already guessed, I'm not film/ literature scholar who is able to discuss aesthetics by comparing different artworks against each other, or even blindly moving in these rich texts... I hadn't heard of "hero's journeys" or Aristotle's rules on tragedy (very useful for s.2 *g*). thanks for the reviews, btw |
| 8. | PJCDec 31, 2006 (Sun)Link | |
| My favorite Fury (solo) episode. He's not my favorite writer for the show by a long way but this is great fun. Thanks for the read. |
| 9. | Clem's Kitten BasketJan 1, 2007 (Mon)Link | |
| Mikejer & bookworm: I'm not telling you what viewpoint you should take, I'm just trying to explain that there are other viewpoints than the one you have chosen. Aren't they all valid in a discussion? Or do you think that there's just one, and only one, "truth"? From my perspective, it's pretty pointless to give standard moral judgements on a vampire's actions - it's like being horrified over the fact that a cat catches birds. Spike has to be viewed as an individual and his actions interpreted from what we learn about him - that is my opininon. I don't agree with Mikejer when he says that we understand Spike "pretty well at this point". I also don't agree with his interpretation, that Spike threatens to unleash Drusilla if Buffy doesn't reciprocate his feelings - to me, it's not about reciprocating, it's about admitting what's already there. Spike knows that there is something between them, that it's not just him, but he needs to hear it from Buffy, or be given the actions that prove it. From the review: "Why did Buffy just let Drusilla leave? That's an incredibly deadly vampire she just let walk away." That's a good question. My answer is that Buffy is completely focused on Spike and the conflicting feelings he has risen within her. To me, it's very clear that neither one of them wants to have these feelings and it stays that way for a long, long time. |
| 10. | mikejerJan 2, 2007 (Tue)Link | |
| Clem: other viewpoints are always valid. It's just surprising to me how much leeway people are willing to give Spike just because's he's a vampire. Imo, that doesn't excuse his frequent questionable behavior. As for Buffy "admitting what's already there," that is definately just your perspective. At this point I really don't think Buffy has any of those kind of feelings for Spike. The end of "Intervention" I'd say is the first time Buffy sees Spike in any substancial kind of non-comical positive light. |
| 11. | AriJan 7, 2007 (Sun)Link | |
| "Imo, that doesn't excuse his frequent questionable behavior." I'm far from being a Spike apologist but I do think his vampiric nature should be taken into consideration. He's not human, the way he expresses his love is naturally not going to adhere to normal human standards. But do we doubt that his 100+ years of loving Drusilla was real? I don't, so why I should dismiss his feelings for Buffy? I never claimed that chaining Buffy up wasn't wrong, it was, and more than just a little bit creepy - eyebrow raise, really not necessary. Thank you. Oh and it's definitely not just Clem's perspective. Not that I think she's in love with him or anything then, but sexually attracted? Buffy's got eyeballs doesn't she? :P Of course she's attracted. And I do consider my opinion nearly canon (refers to Buffy's babbling ep 7x12). "I'd say is the first time Buffy sees Spike in any substancial kind of non-comical positive light." Well, she was definitely taking him seriously in Fool For Love. Girl was majorly upset by all of his taunting, not so much with the taking him as one big joke. And in the end, the porch scene? In the DVD commentary Doug Petrie emphasises how not only is it of note that Spike tries to comfort her, it's also that she lets him. It not twoo wuv 4 eva, but there was something there between them. |
| 12. | AriJan 7, 2007 (Sun)Link | |
| And dude you must be blind if you didn't see any sexual tension (mutual) between Spike and Buffy in FFL. That too was deliberate on DP's part. =D |
| 13. | mikejerJan 7, 2007 (Sun)Link | |
| I just want to be clear that I'm not discounting Spike's feelings. They are very real. He loves her, in the best way a vampire without a soul can. But that's my point: he doesn't have a soul so he can't love to the full range of what I believe love can offer. It's also true that Buffy and Spike have had moments of sexual tension with each other, but that's still a ways away from respecting or looking positively at someone. I believe the first time Buffy really sees Spike in that way is the end of "Intervention." I hope clears up my opinion. :) |
| 14. | TranquillityFeb 19, 2007 (Mon)Link | |
| I think there is plenty of evidence in the canon to show that Spike is capable of real love - not just a twisted vampire version of love. it has been established that Spike is an anomaly in the vampire world and has managed - somehow - to retain some humanity, mostly demonstrated by his ability to love and care, even after becoming a vampire. His 'Spike' vampire persona is his effort to disguise this flaw in his demonic self. His disguise only fails when it comes to the girls he really cares about and loves, that is Drucilla, Buffy and i would argue (in season 5 & early 6 at least), Dawn. That he expresses love differently is to be expected - he is a vampire and has lived by vampire rules for 130 odd years, but it in no way diminishes the feelings he has for Buffy. From the first moments we are made privvy to his thoughts in Out Of My Mind, we are told that it is LOVE he feels for her, not a vampiric corruption of love. His offering to stake Dru is a big deal, sure not the gesture of romance we human gals might be looking for but it is huge for Spike. In the crypt scene, I think it is interesting that Buffy doesn't hit Spike until both the other girls (Harmony and Dru) have gone and that the way they stand and Buffy's body language suggests possesiveness of Spike. She clearly has very mixed emotions when it comes to Spike, even if at this point they are mostly unacknowledged. Cheers |
| 15. | AustinAug 29, 2007 (Wed)Link | |
| Love the bar tender in the silver outfit, she is an extra in almost every bronze scene, hmm... you'd think her outfit, dare I say uniform would be, well, Bronze. Harmony, a girl can't remember how long they've been together, lol! I always thought that the sub-joke about Joyce not feeling safe was because Giles was there (think band candy) anyways it's always been funnier to me that way. |
| 16. | gabrielleabelleNov 12, 2007 (Mon)Link | |
| I'm admittedly a Spike-sympathizer. But I admit that he handles things poorly quite a bit of the time. He doesn't have any sort of moral compass to guide him, though, so he's flying blind in trying to show his affection to Buffy. He knows that fighting with her doesn't affect her on the same level it does him. So he dresses in preppy clothes a la normal-guy-Riley and tries to integrate into her life by chatting her up in the Bronze. Later, he tries again by taking her out on a warped version of a date (a slayer-related outing probably seemed perfect date material to him). Then he gets harshly rejected by Buffy and tempted by Drusilla. So, he discovers that going the "nice guy" route didn't work out(And, in fact, ended up with Buffy completely disregarding his feelings). He decides to be a bit more insistent and chains Buffy up. Bad? Yeah. But all he knows is that Buffy didn't like the date, so he's gonna try something else. That something is killing his ex-girlfriend (salvation, dark princess, etc), and then asking Buffy to admit that there might be a small chance of something between them. Still bad? Well, yeah. But it's Spike and he doesn't quite understand that. His look at the end breaks my heart every time. I do agree with MikeJer, though. While Buffy may be somewhat attracted to Spike at this point, she doesn't start actually SEEING him as a "person" until Intervention. |
| 17. | buffyholicNov 26, 2007 (Mon)Link | |
| This is another wonderful episode in a wonderful season and I´m glad mikejer gave it the rating it deserves. I have to say that I also love Harmony in here: first with the sex games, acting like Buffy and then when she leaves, I always laugh at her line: "No threesome". Unless it´s boy, boy, girl. Or Charlize Theron". |
| 18. | AndreaAug 4, 2008 (Mon)Link | |
| Did anyone notice the earlier-season parallel when Spike shows up at the Bronze in khaki pants and a baby blue dress shirt? Angel tried the same thing (in almost the same shirt!) with Buffy in an early S2 episode (the one where Cordelia tries to commandeer his attention at the Bronze... "Well, his loss is your incredible gain!") I love that joke, that the vamp guys try to go all khaki because they think that's what Buffy will find attractive... I love Dawn's crush on Spike. I love that friendship altogether. Also, love Xander's jealousy at Dawn's newfound crush! Also love Willow and Tara's "Quasimodo" conversation. Spike is a little more aesthetically pleasing as our amoral-love-hero, though. |
| 19. | AndreaAug 5, 2008 (Tue)Link | |
| Also, about why doesn't Buffy kill Drusilla... I noticed that as well in Lie to Me when Buffy grabs hold of her and then makes good on her word to exchange her for the hostage-vamp-wannabe-people... I wonder if she has some kind of underlying sympathy for Drusilla as Spike's girlfriend, or, say, Darla as Angel's ex-girlfriend. I'm not sure exactly, but I think it has something to do with subconsciously "respecting" that or not wanting to be *that* cruel to kill the significant other... Or something. And especially because Drusilla is a woman, I think. Maybe Buffy somehow identifies with her or Darla in that way. Maybe that factors in somewhere too. All this is very subconscious, of course. Hard to explain - I hate when I can't quite explain my thoughts! |
| 20. | ValAug 29, 2008 (Fri)Link | |
| Ah, but didn't you notice how Buffy sits down in the train Drusilla ravaged, on a seat where one of the victims had stood? And you see that white outline surrounding her body... I see it as a very cool subtle way to foreshadow Buffy's death in just a few episodes time. |
| 21. | adastraSep 6, 2008 (Sat)Link | |
| A friend of mine pointed out that the song "I wanna be sedated" by The Ramones which Spike sings in his car (he has a car?!) is a perfect example of how he's feeling. Here are the lyrics: Twenty-twenty-twenty four hours to go I wanna be sedated Nothin' to do and no where to go-o-oh I wanna be sedated Just get me to the airport put me on a plane Hurry hurry hurry before I go insane I can't control my fingers I can't control my brain Oh no no no no no Twenty-twenty-twenty four hours to go.... Just put me in a wheelchair, get me on a plane Hurry hurry hurry before I go insane I can't control my fingers I can't control my brain Oh no no no no no Twenty-twenty-twenty four hours to go I wanna be sedated Nothin' to do and no where to go-o-o I wanna be sedated Just put me in a wheelchair get me to the show Hurry hurry hurry before I go loco I can't control my fingers I can't control my toes Oh no no no no no Twenty-twenty-twenty four hours to go... Just put me in a wheelchair... Ba-ba-bamp-ba ba-ba-ba-bamp-ba I wanna be sedated |
| 22. | TonySep 7, 2008 (Sun)Link | |
| The reason why Buffy lets Drucila and Harmony walk all the time, and even Spike is because -- they would die and the show would lose a cast member. Lol, that's really all it is. They're good characters that they never wanted to ever kill. I always thought though they should kill Drucila by the end of the series on Buffy or Angel but it never happened. |
| 23. | PaulaSep 9, 2008 (Tue)Link | |
| That "date" Spike arranges with Buffy is one of the moments in the show that are just painfully funny. One thing I always wonder about, though, is how the hell come Spike's feelings for her came as such a total surprise to Buffy when he already tried to kiss her back in Fool for Love. |
| 24. | NixSep 30, 2008 (Tue)Link | |
| Tony, 'the show would lose a cast member' has never really stopped Whedon. He's killed off far more important regulars (e.g. Joyce just an episode from now) with much less warning (Jenny Calendar perhaps, but the canonical example of sudden-and-shocking has to be Tara). I think Buffy didn't kill Drusilla purely because she was too busy emotionally with all the other things that were going on to consider it. (Also, it would wreck her delicate just-aborning detente with Spike.) |
| 25. | NixOct 5, 2008 (Sun)Link | |
| Actually, I wonder almost if Whedon *avoided* killing Drusilla to mess with our heads. From the moment I first heard her name I expected Spike to dust her sooner or later (as the historical Drusilla was first shagged and then likely offed/driven-to-suicide by Caligula). And then she didn't get killed at all. |
| 26. | PaulaOct 5, 2008 (Sun)Link | |
| From the shooting script I've gathered that the idea was that at the end, everyone was too tired from fighting to fight any more, so Drusilla got away. Which, looking at the actual episode, I don't really buy. I bet though that it was thought just plain impossible to kill Drusilla off, with all the potential uses for the character in future episodes. In retrospect of course, since they never got around to using her again on either BtVS or AtS, they might as well have done it. (IMO, by right it should be Spike that finally dusts her, whenever that happens.) |
| 27. | PaulaOct 7, 2008 (Tue)Link | |
| A further comment to Nix: actually, Whedon & co. originally intended to kill Spike off pretty quickly and keep Dru as a big bad (together with Angel, at least in S2). How plans change... :-) |
| 28. | bigmoneygripNov 23, 2008 (Sun)Link | |
| Love, love, love the dancing with Xander/Anya and Willow/Tara. Like the song, too. Spike and his flowering onion obsession (offers Buffy a flask) ewww it's not blood it's bourbon ewwww Spike = Ramones fan! |
| 29. | EmilyMay 28, 2009 (Thu)Link | |
| I can't get that look on his face out of my head- when he's blocked out of the house. Poor baby!!! |
| 30. | jarppuMay 28, 2009 (Thu)Link | |
| @Emily Spike had just kidnapped Buffy and tied her up in a cave. Yes, poor bady indeed. Poor evil-blood-sucking-soulless-vampire-kidnapper ... -baby. It is a little counter-productive for a show, who's initial premise was feministic and symphatetic to the social outcast, to have a character like Spike. Especially when Spike is shown in such a symphatetic light(poor baby!) even though he doesn't exactly fit the "feministic and social outcast" -mold. Oh well. I'm definitely a fan of "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" but I'm not fan of the "Spike, the cool vampire" that the show transformed into starting from this season. |
| 31. | ShannonMay 28, 2009 (Thu)Link | |
| @Emily: Agreed. This is one of the many many times when JM uses facial expressions to convey so much more than words could have. @jarppu: Did you watch Fool For Love? Spike is the original outcast of this group! His whole "cool" persona is an act, a facade, that he's spent the better part of a century building up piece by piece. All it took was a single sentence from Buffy ("You're beneath me") to shatter that facade and leave him in tears. This, and much of Spike's behavior, is clearly not the mark of "Spike, the cool vampire", but of a layered individual with some very complex and conflicting characteristics. And to say Spike takes away from the feminist message of the show is just, well, wrong. Spike has spent his unlife seeking out Vampire Slayers, who just happen to be women you know, because he knows that they are the only truly worthy opponent. A WOMAN is the only opponent worthy of a supernatural creature with superhuman strength? C'mon, how much more feminist can you get? Even when he stops trying to kill her, his respect for and admiration of Buffy is pretty limitless. He basically worships the woman, and as his lover, he straight out acknowledges her superiority in the sack. I don't see how you could possibly call this anti-feminist. Contrast that with the first couple seasons in which we have Xander, who sees her as as a hot girl whom he thinks needs his help picking out a boyfriend, and Angel, who really just wants to protect her, and I'd say Spike actually vastly improves the feminist message of the show. Plus, it's obvious that once Spike became popular with fans, the writers made a concerted effort to try to remind viewers how evil and soulless he was (see, Season 6), not to turn the show into a cool vampire show. |
| 32. | ShannonMay 28, 2009 (Thu)Link | |
| Further, I think you're in part missing the point if you think Buffy has to fit into a "feminist and social outcast" mold. There's so much more going on than that. |
| 33. | EmmaSep 20, 2009 (Sun)Link | |
| A little thing, but can I get a massive "HELL YEAH!" for Harmony shooting Spike with the crossbow here? Random Crowd: HELL YEAH! Thank you. |
| 34. | SusanSep 24, 2009 (Thu)Link | |
| *Shannon, I have to say that I love the thoughts that you shared concerning Spike's character. Very insightful and it goes a long way in making sense of much of what he does. We see him so vulnerable responding to the hurtful way that Buffy treats him. She deliberately says the things that hurt him the most, telling him that he's beneath her, that he disgusts her, never thanking him for any of the things that he does to help her, etc. To me, his character is much more convincing than that of Angel. Spike loves Buffy all the time, not just when he has a soul. He doesn't have two separate personalities. Just one very complex one.
*Mikejer, I hope you are still working on this site. I thoroughly enjoy reading all your reviews and I'm looking forward to your final reviews of Season 7. Hope you're doing okay. |
| 35. | mikejerSep 24, 2009 (Thu)Link | |
| @Susan: Don't worry, all is well. A new review will be coming out soon along with something else that will reveal where a lot of my time has been spent the last month. |
| 36. | SunburnOct 31, 2009 (Sat) @ 3:51amLink | |
| I'd agree that Buffy not only doesn't have any romantic feelings for Spike, but is completely repulsed by the idea of having them. I think at least part of this is repressed revulsion at Angel's misdeeds that she didn't allow herself to feel at the time. I think Buffy at this point has kind of separated Spike and Angel into black and white in vamp terms - Angel is the pure romantic hero of her dreams, all the more perfect for never really having been around full-time, so that Spike gets landed with all the horror and disgust at his unashamed brutality. But, having said that, it is quite clear that there is a spark between them, and Buffy's overdone repulsion is further proof of that. Why does she batter Puffy Xander (lol!) so vigorously? Why does she make a point of looking for Spike when Ben is chatting her up? She doesn't want a relationship with him, she thinks she doesn't even want to touch him or have him near her, but there is a nagging curiosity in the back of her mind about what it would be like, and that's why she gets so angry. If she really wasn't attracted to him at all, she wouldn't need to make such a point of it and it wouldn't bug her the way it does. (I think. :-D ) |
| 37. | Sam LOct 31, 2009 (Sat) @ 6:24pmLink | |
| At this point, I agree that Buffy may acknowledge to herself that Spike is a good-looking guy, but she does not here feel the need to tell him that because there's no point. His path toward redemption does not commence until Joyce's death, so since he has not yet done anything to warrant her looking at him in a positive light, she has no obligation to say, "yeah, there's something there". In fact, in this episode, he behaves terribly throughout--kidnapping Buffy and threatening to kill her, telling Dawn horrible stories about his quests, slapping Harmony around (again) the second Drusilla shows up. This is all hilarious, but she is completely in the right and he is completely in the wrong here. He is still evil here, but he has nice cheekbones, so this causes confusion among some fans. Buffy is completely right and Spike is completely wrong in this episode, but what's so funny is that Marsters has such amazing facial expressions that Spike can behave like a monster and fans will still let him get away with it. |
| 38. | CirrusNov 21, 2009 (Sat) @ 10:24amLink | |
| Ah, your reviews are always a complete pleasure to read. :)
I like how you acknowledge that you're a Spike fan, but you don't make excuses for his behaviour. It seems to be that there are so many anti-Spike fans who insist that anybody who likes his character are delusional and 'let him get away' with brutal behaviour. This is why I don't like Buffy/Spike in season 6 -- I love Spike, I love Buffy, they're my favourite characters and I enjoy seeing them together, but I don't like the way it was done. I like Buffy's reaction here, she took the first step in trying to remove Spike from her life, by uninviting him to her house. She doesn't want to kill him, she just wants him gone from her life, like she said. In season 6 I just can't understand her behaviour. The amount of times she sleeps with him, will be asleep next to him, a killer whom she really doesn't know or can trust. He could just bite her. In fact, I think it was slightly OOC of him NOT to think about biting her when she was in that position. I can remember several moments where he prepared to kill her to make his life easier, to get him out of her mind. The fact that she just lets herself become that vulnerable... sleeping with a vampire. She didn't even trust Angel all the time, and he had a soul. Spike gave her few reasons to 100% trust him, and that's how she acts. I also don't think that Buffy even likes Spike as a person here, never mind sees him as a romance potential. I think she saw the attempted kiss in Fool for Love as something simply perverted. |
| 39. | ShannonNov 23, 2009 (Mon) @ 4:50pmLink | |
| @Cirrus - I agree about anti-Spike fans. I think he's a fascinating, complex character, and I tend to enjoy episodes more when he is in them, but I'm not making excuses for his behavior. And no, SamL, I'm not blinded by his cheekbones or his sculpted pecs (as has been claimed by others who dislike Spike)- I think the guy is an incredible actor, and he really does bring a lot to the role through his ability to convey complex emotions through his facial expressions. As to your charge of "letting him get away with" his evil deeds, well, nobody's arguing that he's not still doing evil things. However, I believe that by this point he has become conflicted in that evil, and is floundering around trying to figure out what is right and how to get Buffy's attention. As gabrielleabelle points out up in comment #16, he is a demon without a soul, and thus lacks any kind of moral compass, making it difficult to figure out that it's not ok to kidnap and threaten the woman you love. Yes, what he did in this episode is obviously very wrong, but he doesn't understand that, and is truly hurt by being uninvited from Buffy's house. I think the fact that Marsters can elicit sympathy for a character whose actions were otherwise completely unsympathetic is a testament to his ability as an actor. Sorry, that's kind of jumbled, but I don't think it's fair to dismiss interest in the character and the skill of the actor portraying him as girls falling for his cheekbones. |
| 40. | MortDec 7, 2009 (Mon) @ 1:42amLink | |
| As far as Buffy being OOC by being so relaxed around dangerous Spike in S6, I think that it's pretty well established that it's a side effect of her being so depressed during that season and doing anything to feel. Speaking from my own experience, and from what I've seen of my friends who have gone through serious depression, being there makes you do stupid things that aren't in your nature. When you get over it you look back and think "Wow, that was stupid" but at the time, even if you're aware it's foolish, you really don't care. Also she's pretty desperate to feel anything, so I'd imagine letting her guard down around someone dangerous would incite fear and excitement... so yeah, enabling her to feel something.
Just my take on it... By the way, Mike, i've never commented before, but I love the site and your reviews... |
| 41. | Blue FanJan 14, 2010 (Thu) @ 12:00pmLink | |
| Great episode!
My biggest complaint about it has been already pointed out by you in your CONS. Why wasn't Drusilla staken at the end of the episode???? Not only did Buffy forgot the dead people on the train (that was very concerned at the beginnig of the episode), but also she forgot about Kendra's death. Remember, back in S2? I strongly feel that, besides this, she failed in her duties as the Slayer. Yet, at the end of the episode, nobody seems to care! (just like in Buffy vs. Dracula) |
| 42. | DFAS GIlesJan 18, 2010 (Mon) @ 5:59pmLink | |
| I had forgotten how much I love this episode. It has great cinematography (the scene of Dru and Spike walking towards the couple on the balcony - something about Dru's posture is totally arresting), great acting (the oft-mentioned facial expressions of JM and SMG), and hilarious comedy. I especially crack up at the "you bloody women" monologue, because it is so completely over the top. Regarding the Spike apologists and Spike judge, jury, and executioner perspectives... As has been mentioned above, Spike doesn't have a soul, and doesn't have a highly developed moral compass, though he seems to have more of a bearing than most vamps. As a result, he tries to express his love for Buffy in ways that we, ensouled viewers, generally find abhorrent. The fact that Spike acts cruelly (to us) in an attempt to prove his feelings (and continues to act reprehensibly for much of the rest of the series) seems to provoke certain reactions of, "see, he's a killer and abusive and therefore doesn't deserve our forgiveness or pity." But I don't think it's incompatible to accept that Spike can be cruel, and at the same time feel pity for him. People who do horrible things still have feelings and are still vulnerable to being hurt. They are still people, with (generally) the full range of emotions as the rest of us. It's just easier for us, for anyone who has been wronged, to imagine that people who do horrible things are somehow bereft of emotion. It gives us permission to hate them, because if they are evil they can't possibly be like us, can't possibly bleed if we prick them. If Spike was just an evil soulless thing with not a spark of humanity, it would be easier to hate him - we wouldn't even have to think twice about it. But when you see the look on Spike's face when Buffy uninvites him, or says he's beneath her, of course we can feel pity for him. We see a being who is suffering, and some common part of us empathises with being hurt, kicks into "he looks an awful lot like me when I get hurt" mode. Which, I think, is an extension of the reason we demonise people. We don't want to see ourselves in soulless killers. We don't want to believe that we could ever do something so correspondingly horrible. Because of course we can and do. To me, this episode brings back the memory of Riley and Buffy arguing over demons being good or bad, but nothing in between, no greys. Whedon continues the debate here by provoking us into asking, "how can I be feeling such pity for a brutal killer?" And then he spins it around and gives us Willow, beloved Scooby and human, who in a later season does something terrible. Or take Warren and the trio. Who is evil? Who deserves our compassion? Who can be redeemed? |
| 43. | LizzieJul 16, 2010 (Fri) @ 9:05amLink | |
| If there's something I never liked about Buffy is the way she treats Spike. One time she's asking him to show her how he killed the other slayers. He tells her. She doesn't like what she heard. She tells him he's "beneath" her. One time she tells him she never needs him. Then she goes to his crypt so that Spike can take care of Dawn and Joyce. She takes Spike along to find Dawn. He gets beaten up by Glory in her defense. After that, he tries to make conversation with her at The Bronze, and she treats him like dirt, and puts down the value of his help. I just think Buffy's really selfish, and that she just manipulates people, but when she doesn't need them, she discards them. Very selfish. |
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